#077 Parents Guide to Gifted Kids’ First Years of School Series #2 Part 2 w/ Stephanie Higgs

Stephanie H: for parents?

Sophia, those are my favorite questions. They’re such good questions. As someone on the other side, so a lot of, you know, our, our listeners are gonna be parents, but I’m coming from the educational side, so I love kind of partnering and saying we are a team. First and foremost, we are a team. You as the parent are your child’s biggest advocate and you know them best.

I have more experience on the education side and I have, you know, some background and some expertise and years of experience there. But you know, your child the best. But the best part is we’re both huge strong advocates for your kids. So we are a team. And so that I think, kind of frees up some of that is it’s never am I, am I overstepping?

Am I, am I saying too much? But you do know your kid best and you’ve had, when they’re entering kindergarten, you’ve had four or five or six years, you know, of every minute, every day with this kiddo and a teacher is new to that picture. And so we, we do have to partner, we have to link. It’s not, am I [00:04:00] overstepping or whose job is this?

Or, you know, we, we really have to work together. Here’s a few qualities maybe, maybe that would be helpful. It’s just kind of thinking through some of the qualities that you can look for in those really little people. Something I look for is just endless boundless creativity. I’m talking, you can give them any supply, you can give them something boring and, and you look over and they’re creating, they’re making, they’re playing they’re inventing a new game or they’re taking something and, and making a link that you, you would never think of.

So that creativity I think can just be really exponential in lots of gifted kids, but especially when they’re still young and they’re still playing and they’re so imaginative. Sometimes it’s when we have those quirky little people that are almost like many adults and you just think, oh, it’s just this grown up person in this tiny pre-packaged little five-year-old body.

So sometimes they have these really advanced qualities about them. Things like just a really large vocabulary of voracious reader. I love thinking about the idea that sometimes it’s like they’re just born to know things, that they are just. So, insatiably [00:05:00] curious, they can’t get enough. The idea that they seem to just know things and you think, where did you pick that up?

Where did you, I’ve never said that. Where did you get that from? Like, just this insatiable curiosity. They’re picking up things everywhere. There’s sponges. You don’t even know they’re, they’re picking up and, and digesting and applying all this information. Something else I think that we look for in those really little friends is an emotional depth that seems to really surpass their age as well as sometimes like a sense, a deep levels of sensitivity or injustice.

I’ve had a student previously who was a self-identified and, and self-chosen vegetarian from a very young age. No one else in her family is a vegetarian. This is because of her deep rooted, deep sense of injustice for animals. She’s such a big heart for them. She cannot bear the thought of eating meat.

Her family eats meat, but for her, that’s very personal. She can’t do

Sophia Elliott: it. . I think we need to add, is your child a vegetarian to their gifted traits list, . Cause it’s a sure sign. Don’t, [00:06:00] excuse me, my voice is a bit croaking. And now, and I’m not saying all gifted kids are vegetarians, but, but those who are at a really young age, it’s almost like, okay, tell me about that , you know?

Yes, yes.

Stephanie H: And it almost always pairs with that deep sense of justice. So whether that’s a heart for other countries, whether that’s a heart for animals, whether that’s a heart for people in need, whether that’s, I mean, it could be for anything, but you just think, wow, at this young, young age, a lot of us are still very self-focused.

And so for you to already be showing such deep levels of empathy and understanding and, and concern for the world at large, that’s very rare for a child at this age. Diverse interests, you know, just lots of different interests and lots of different things. Being really creative at problem solving, you know, and, and that’s fun to watch.

Sometimes we’ll make it in a pickle and you just kind of, you don’t just immediately jump into help and say, oh, here, here’s, here’s how we’re gonna fix this. Kind of, if they’re in a problem kind of watching how they, they kind of look around and think, okay, what, what can I use? How can I be resourceful? I’ve seen them do all sorts of funny, creative things, even if it’s [00:07:00] pencil and paper, like if they have a math challenge and the way they can’t physically manipulate and move the parts, but the way they like, Squinch them with their fingers, just

They’re just trying to problem solve and manipulate and move. So, those are just a few of the qualities. There’s tons of resources, I’m sure online and some of our gifted, you know, curriculum and programming that we put out all over the world. But those are just a few of the qualities that just come to mind when I think of my own gifted learners that I serve.

And then as far as questions to ask, gosh, I love that question so much, but I think A few, a few things that I would think about there is I think that kindergarten should be a magical experience for your child. And a gifted learner has been waiting to be in kindergarten for their whole life.

That’s so true.

Sophia Elliott: This idea of I get to go to school and they’re so excited. It’s just, oh,

Stephanie H: they’re so excited. I have a student a friend of mine was, was a kindergarten teacher and one of her students was crying the first Saturday of kindergarten because she didn’t get to go see Ms. Jones. And so [00:08:00] I thought, what kind of magical experience can you make that a kindergarten?

They’re exhausted, you know, the first week of school, oh, they’re so tired by the weekend and it’s Saturday, and she’s crying because she doesn’t get to see Ms. Jones that day. And so I just think that kindergarten should be the most magical, the most magical space and experience. So I think that’s a good way of knowing if your kindergartner’s needs are being met.

Are they coming home asking for questions, wanting to research, reporting? This is what we did and this is what we did. Andy McNair does a lot of work. She was previously a gifted teacher. Now she does tons of consulting and professional development. And at our national Gifted conference just a couple months ago in November, I went to one of Andy’s sessions.

She gave the best metaphors. She was talking about, first she was talking about snorkeling versus scuba diving and how important it’s for us to take our gifted learners to scuba diving. We’re not snorkeling, we’re not staying here at the surface when they’ve got these interests and passions, we need to go scuba diving kinda stays with that water metaphor.

Stephanie Higgs: And she goes into the concept of surfing and she was talking about how you’re never going to have a surfing experience and leave. And someone says, how was [00:09:00] surfing? And you’re gonna say, Hmm. It was okay. I don’t really remember, bored You’re never gonna get those answers. Oh my goodness. Let me tell you this wave, I’ve had to do this and then this wave, I’ve had to do this.

And then I got this perfect moment and then, you know, and, and I tried four more times and I couldn’t recreate it. But then this, this happened and you just can’t get them to stop talking about it, right? It’s just, it’s an experience. When any of us have these experiences, we can’t stop talking about it.

That’s how school should be for our gifted learners.

Stephanie H: And when Andy drove that point home, I think about that. That’s totally reshaped every day. Am I creating a surfing experience for my student or are, are we getting there? Are they leaving school saying, well, I don’t remember what I did today. I don’t know, I’m tired.

I’m, you know, or are they able to give me, well, no, you’ll never guess. We did this and then we learned this. And mom, where did this come from? And Dad, how about this? And do you know the, you know, that’s, that’s what we want our kids leaving school thinking. Other questions that I think you can ask of that teacher as far as overstepping, but what about pretesting?

How do you, how do you gauge what my child comes into kindergarten knowing? [00:10:00] And so what type of data are you collecting? How are you pretesting them? Okay. If their data is really strong and they know a lot, how are you going to differentiate accordingly? How is instruction gonna look different for my kiddo to buy back some of that time?

So when we think about if 95% of kids are walking in the door knowing how to count from one to 10, but teachers are still reporting that the, a large requirement is, is is spending time counting to one to 10, what types of differentiation do you do to meet those individual needs of my kid? How’s their work going to look a little bit different?

I think asking yourself questions like, is my child engaged every day? You know, that kind of leads back to, to kind of the surfboard analogy. How do you know my child’s engaged every day? Are they wondering every day? I think something else to think about is, are they able to explain their thinking?

I think sometimes with our littles, we can fast forward because they catch on so quickly and we’re moving so rapidly. But are they able to explain? Because kindergarten is where that starts to be really, I. If they can do it mentally, that’s so fantastic. That tells us they’ve got a really well [00:11:00] developed number of cents, but we wanna start teaching them the habit of slowing down enough to be able to understand the why and to understand how they got there.

Because again, it’s inevitable at some point, whether it’s in kindergarten, whether it’s in ninth grade, whether it’s in, you know, college level coursework, they will be. Presented with these levels of challenges, and they’re gonna have to be able to explain how they got there to do an error analysis to figure out what they don’t know.

And so making sure that even at those very early stages that, that we’re able to really kind of help them understand their thinking. So I think these are great questions to ask of teachers. You know, what, what ways does the teacher know the kids engaged? How are they pre-assessing to figure out what they do know?

How are they going to make things look differently accordingly? Again, this is a great place. If we didn’t ask before we made the school selection, what types of gifted services are offered? If that’s something that my child was qualifying for, again, what would that change in their school day? How would that look different?

You know, what do you have to offer there? So those are just kind of a few of my initial thoughts. Mm-hmm. , what about you?

Sophia Elliott: [00:12:00] A lot of parents will ask, do I, you know, in approaching a new school, I think there’s an uncertainty with parents of, do I just kind of go in all guns blazing? Like, look, my kid’s gifted. What do you got? Who’s qualified? What can you offer them? Or it’s kind of the stealth approach of looking for clues and trying to get a, a, a vibe from the school, but not wanting to kind of be in your face, kind of.

I think my kid’s gifted and I always encourage parents to be upfront and mm-hmm. and, and from the GetGo. Uh, and I would, would and have been that parent who’s is doing the tour and kind of going, beautiful classrooms are amazing. I love hearing about this and that. Do you have gifted students at this school?

How do you meet their needs? What qualifications do your staff have? [00:13:00] Mm-hmm. and because. For me as a parent, and the stories I hear from so many parents is, like you said before, right? Which is a breath of fresh air. We are a team and as parents, were desperately wanting to be a team with the educators because we are not educators.

We we’re, you know, we’re outsourcing this task to someone because we’re like recognizing and appreciating all of the amazing skills, experience, and qualifications that you have to educate our little people. And, and that for me is incredibly valuable and I appreciate it hugely. And, you know, teachers are, are so underrated and underpaid.

Like that’s just, it’s just is, right? It’s the truth of it because the role is so important and so I wanna be working. [00:14:00] as a team with the educators of my kids, I wanna be able to have that open conversation. And it’s not that I expect the teacher to have all the answers, and I think sometimes there can be that insecurity of, am I being questioned or you know, and I’m sure that teachers have to deal with some very challenging parents from time to time who are having very challenging situations.

And and I know it’s not always easy, but you know, I can recall having a conversation with a teacher of one of my kids and I was just kind of like, look. Wes in this at home. I don’t know what it’s about, . But just a heads up, if you, you’re getting a bit of this behavior you know, we can just kind of chat about it and, and, but the conversation was kind of like, you know, if I have a light bulb moment, I’ll share it.

And, and they were like, yeah, if, if we figure something out, we’ll share and we’ll just see where we get to, right? Because it’s a journey. We don’t all have all the answers, but I think [00:15:00] the more upfront you can be from the beginning, you’re gonna get a sense of who you’re working with. And in, in our experience, it’s as important to get us a feel for the educator as it is for the school leadership.

Because at some point that educator will need to go to the school leadership to get, , approval to do certain things. And you need to know that the school leadership is an open, , open with possibilities, you know, a cup puff, full kind of person. , someone who’s up for suggestions and ideas in, in, in respect to what the educator might wanna do with that child.

And so, yeah, personally and I, and I say this knowing that it is a very challenging to be that parent going, look, my kid’s gifted, or I think my kid is gifted. And getting all sorts of responses. I’ve had those responses as well. I know it’s tricky, but I just think it’s worth that [00:16:00] initial pain to get a real sense of who you’re potentially gonna be working with for the next, who knows how many years, ideally, 12 years.

You know, no one wants to keep moving our kids from school to school and, and like you said there, , I agree. School should be an absolute wonder for all of our kids, and it’s. Horrific to think that research shows that gifted kids can spend up to 80% of the year not learning anything. , , I hate to think what is happening to that relationship they have with their educators in their school journey in that 80% of time just losing that faith and trust and spirit of curiosity.

And so, yeah. I love some of the things that you’re sharing there about just saying or how do you differentiate at this school? , you know, what kind of things do you do to try and accommodate the different learning styles and, uh, abilities within the [00:17:00] classroom? Uh, how are you gonna meet the needs of my kid who is potentially already reading at kindergarten level, at grade, you know, age or grade one age, really fluently.

I, I, you know what, what might be a real test of character of a school is to ask the question. So, and particularly if you are, this applies to your child, but even just to kind of gauge their reaction of like, what do you do if, uh, you know, a kinder or grade one child is already reading chapter books? How do you approach that situation?

Yeah. Because a lot of anecdotally, you hear a lot of educators and librarians will. Be a real barrier to allowing that gifted child to read books that are, uh, you know, at their level. [00:18:00] And you hear this a lot from parents. It’s like, my kids in grade one, they’re already reading chapter books or Harry Potter, but they’re not allowed to borrow from that section of the library.

And it’s kind of like, what are we doing to, you know, that need is not being met here. Go read the cat, sat on the mat. Right. You know, in the, in the two seconds before you start your Harry Potter book. So there are different clues and red flags I think. But ultimately, like Stephanie, you’re an absolute unicorn.

We talk about unicorns on this show and, and I think you’re a wonderful example of the kind of educator we’re all looking for as parents. And it’s lovely to hear you. Talk about it from that educator point of view. And some of the things that we can look for as parents and, and also giving us all hope, of course, that there are more people like yourself out there willing to be open.

And [00:19:00] the other thing that I’ve come across just quickly is also, uh, if you can’t get an educator who has that gifted knowledge, the next best thing is an educator who says, look, I don’t know a lot about it, but let’s figure it out together. That person is gold. , they’re another, they’re another unicorn, basically.

And, and I’ve had that person as well and I’m like, beautiful. Let’s figure it out together. Cuz ultimately, if you are committed to knowing my child and meeting their needs, that’s who I need. Right?

Stephanie H: Absolutely. Absolutely. That’s so important.

Sophia Elliott: Yeah, absolutely. [00:20:00] So, as we kind of wrap up, I wanna ask are there any other sort of misconceptions, uh, out there that are, are worthy of us having a quick chat about or unpacking about sort of gifted learners in those early years?

Anything else.

Stephanie H: So here you ask the perfect and best questions. That was kind of mentally one more thing I had thought. If I got a chance to dispel any misconceptions, I would love to. So, perfect question. Perfect time. One of the first ones I would love to just caution both parents and educators to remember is that a lot of times our gifted students have asynchronous development.

And if that’s a new phrase to you, uh, asynchronous development is, is uneven development. And so sometimes our intellect in these tiny people is so advanced, but they are having a melt. Down, come apart that is very [00:21:00] appropriate or maybe even below kind of what you would expect of a child that’s their age.

And so asynchronous development is really common. And so I would never want a parent or a teacher to say, oh, well they’re acting like this. That’s not what I would expect of a student who’s advanced. And so, you know, they, they can’t be gifted or you know, a parent to say, well, yes, they did this, but you know, they, they behaved like this and, and they got so upset.

That’s actually yet another indicator that there is potential giftedness. There is that asynchronous development that it can look really uneven. And so that can even be problematic for more. You know, students that are a little bit further along in school that will, they’re a mess. You know, they’re, they’re constantly in trouble.

Things like that. Again, that development can be asynchronous and so it can be honor even, you know, kind of below peers sometimes social, emotionally, pre-vocational skills as far as organization and things like that. But we don’t have to say, oh, they’re really disorganized and messy. They can’t be advanced.

They can’t need, you know, different work. Sometimes those actually do go hand in hand. That’s really important. I [00:22:00] think sometimes kind of on that same page, but a little bit more behaviorally that what I’ve learned about our, our tiny people is that if they are not intellectually stimulated, they will seek and they will find that stimulation elsewhere.

And so, you know, there are times that, that I’ll refer a student for gifted testing and, and even the parent will say, what my kid , they’re, they’re getting in trouble a lot. I, I get some negative phone calls from the teacher from the school. You can’t be asking if my kid’s gifted. No, that’s exactly why, why I’m concerned is because I see their data is really strong and I do see these behaviors in the classroom and I think that they’re seeking out these behaviors because that level of challenge is not being met through grade level instruction.

And so they’re looking for stimulation elsewhere. So I think again, just dispelling that myth of behavior is not gonna be commensurate with intellect.

Sophia Elliott: Yeah. And can I tell you what you just said there is just like beautiful because not. Three days ago I was having a conversation with a parent with a child who’s six years old.

And [00:23:00] so in those early years, and they were struggling to have this conversation with the educator cuz the educator’s, like all they’re seeing is this sort of disruptive behavior and it’s like, your child isn’t showing me what they can do. So we are not going to give them anything, you know, above what might be expected of this age because they’re not showing me what they can do.

And this. This is a challenge or albeit for educators, but so common. It’s like this, you’ve gotta jump through the hoop of the boring stuff that is driving you completely insane before. We’re gonna give you the stuff that you’re actually interested in that would resolve the behavior and that, and that’s exactly what you’re saying there.

It’s just beautiful to hear that. From you. Thanks.

Stephanie H: Well, and the phrase I love to use is instead of, rather than in addition to, so we don’t have to, you know, do all of this before we move on. I have, if we were having teacher talk, I could give you some great strategies I use in how to determine [00:24:00] that. But yes, the, instead of, rather than in addition to, is really important, but they don’t have to jump through these hoops before they can access this.

If we would let them fast forward to that that we, we would get better and more high quality work from them. Just a couple other thoughts just really quickly, but. Even if they can, that doesn’t mean they always want to. So I think still letting them be so little and mm-hmm. , you know, just because they can do this doesn’t mean we have to just take it and push it.

Because gifted kid burnout is a real thing. And I know that really we’re so focused, you know, right now on kind of these very early years in giftedness, but we have to look globally at, so what does that look like later? And if we push so hard and so fast at this elementary age, we just wanna be cautious that we’re picking up on those signals.

If they’re sighing and grumbling and, and look sad when we say, Hey, we’re, you know, we’re gonna do this next math, we might need to read that a little bit and, and dig into that to see, you know, because we wanna be sure that just because they can doesn’t mean they always want to.

Stephanie Higgs: Something else kind of along that same line of just accelerating really rapidly and quickly would be not [00:25:00] to skip good literature.

There are so many gorgeous, fantastic, incredible, and amazing picture books. And if we do, like you said, if they come to kindergarten reading chapter books, there’s space for both. And we can hold both of those because sometimes those picture books are really rich and they’re on second and third and fourth grade reading levels, even though they have cute pictures.

So we wanna think about that. But also there’s just so much good literature out there. And like I said, there’s space for both. We want to equip and empower them to take those chapter books and that love of reading and take it as far as they can. But we wouldn’t wanna do that in compromising. We wouldn’t wanna do it instead of there.

We would want those to work together in tandem.

Stephanie H: Which I guess would lead me probably to maybe one, just my final misconception, which would be the idea of depth versus acceleration. Because I think sometimes we get so excited to take them faster, faster, faster. Oh, they can add and subtract. Let’s go ahead and move to multiplication division.

That is a strategy and that is one way to accelerate that content. But there are also layers and layers and layers of depth that we can [00:26:00] really infuse. And again, that’s where parents and teachers would wanna work in tandem. A parent would say, I’m not really sure how to do that. I know if they can add and subtract, maybe I’ll just move to multiplication.

That’s where a teacher could say this. These are some ways to layer in you know, some unknown looking at algebra. Can we balance both sides of an addition equation? Can we solve for an unknown in an algebraic expression? Those are still working with concepts that are a little bit more commensurate with peers.

And what I have found is if we don’t do that, if we just accelerate and we go quickly and we go far, , we go far, but we have developed a lot of holes and gaps in their understanding because they didn’t have that deep immersion kind of that snorkeling versus scuba diving. The Andy McNair used that beautiful analogy.

Yeah, but do we wanna just take ’em snorkeling and we’re gonna go far or do we wanna take ’em scuba diving and dig as deep and as, as slowly and carefully and methodically as we can to give them a really kind of well-versed, immersive experience in the content. And so I think that’s just one last piece that I would ad advise parents.

That’s just when we need to work with teachers because at [00:27:00] home it’s, oh, they can do this so well naturally, this is all I can think of would be to just kind of take ’em to that next step rather than to stay on our current step and really kind of scuba dive, let go deeper. Really develop that so that we don’t move so accelerated and at such a rapid pace that we develop poles and understanding or gaps in think.

Sophia Elliott: Great advice cuz I mean, the gifted brain loves that depth, loves the complexity, so love that. Absolutely wonderful advice. And I love that you’re saying there is space for both picture books and chapter books. I love that there is space for both because here at home, you know, I’ve, there’s four years between my kids, I have three and there’s a very big range of reading abilities within that.

But when I sit down and read a picture book with my kids, they’re all in on that. And picture books have some of the most beautiful just stories, morals, teaching lessons. Like there are some gorgeous books out there. And so I, I [00:28:00] love picture books for that. Like there I have many favorites. Like you say, there’s the good literature, don’t miss the good literature and that can be a real opportunity to engage with your child.

You know, to bring them back to that moment, which is kind of what we do here. You know, now that I’m thinking about it, it’s kind of bringing them back to that moment in a moment of engagement and connection and actually then having a talk about the story. And so you’re providing that depth as well in terms of, let’s have, you know, it’s scuba dive on this particular story.

What is it telling us? What’s the lesson there? And then, and of, you know, our kids just want that connection with us and it’s a really great way of doing that. So I love that, that, uh, language, that there is space for both. Thank you. I’m taking that away with me today. Oh, I’m so. Yeah, absolutely. So Stephanie, thank you so much for your time and your passion and energy today.

It’s been an [00:29:00] absolute delight talking to you, and you obviously have got so much knowledge, uh, to share. And so it’s always very, we’re always very appreciative here of everyone’s grace and generosity in, in sharing that with us. And so for anyone who would like to follow you, I know you’re on Instagram and is.

TikTok, tell us where we can find you on social

Stephanie H: media. That’s I bravest adventure. Yes, that’s right. So Instagram. Instagram was first. I started that just in December, and I already have over a thousand new best friends that are teachers and that are gifted parents. It is driven a little bit more towards gifted educators and even general educators because they all have gifted learners in their classroom.

But I have had parents of my students message me and say, I am so thankful for your Instagram. I am learning about my kid every night based on what you post and what it, it just, it’s all working together beautifully. So I would love to have you on Instagram. It’s. At Little Miss Gifted. And so I would [00:30:00] love to see you on there.

I post almost every day a strategy. Again, just a quick bite size. We’re all overwhelmed, we’re all over stimulated. There’s so many inputs for in us at all times. But just one quick bite size tip, so I’d love to see you there. And then I am bravely venturing into both the TikTok and the YouTube short world.

And that one is at Little Miss Gifted Teacher. Little Miss Gifted was taken on those. So I went with little Miss Gifted teacher on both TikTok and on YouTube. So sharing tons of bite size tips in both locations if parents also had questions. My email address is little miss gifted teacher@gmail.com.

So I would, I always just love partnering with parents. Chatting with parents, so would love to, to connect with you. Instagram’s the primary source, but have lots of other avenues as.

Sophia Elliott: Thank you so much. I’ll put all of those in the show notes so that we can engage there. I’m looking forward to checking that out as well.

And then, thank you so much for today. It’s been absolute delight chatting to you.

Stephanie H: Of course. I have the best time. I would come back anytime you ask thoughtful and just beautiful [00:31:00] questions that I know are just a gift to these parents of gifted learners as well as gifted educators. We, we love partnering with our parents of gifted kiddos to ensure that they achieve maximum success.

So thank you so much for the work that you do in our field.

Sophia Elliott: Thank you. Welcome.